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This is a somewhat new product as it has been around for 5-10 years but information has been hard to find in many cases, leaving us to rely only on the sales advertisements and "word of mouth" reviews. Since this is a product aimed at the lower end of the market, those reviews are often done by new users who may not fully understand some of what they are seeing and being a new product those reviews are often done before some of the faults show up. This is not to slam a product as unusable as it certainly has a place in the market, but I feel it worthwhile to know what we are buying and why it may/may not be as good as we first think. This, like all reviews, is strictly personal opinion but I will assure you that I do not have any money in the game, either for or against. I am reviewing the CO2 Art Dual stage Pro as currently advertised on a number of sites in the $125 US range. This is the site I will refer to, as it does give us a good clean view of the front of the product and it does make an easy place to start: https://www.aquariumcoop.com/products/co2-art-dual-stage-pro-regulator A number of the older users on the forum have looked at this product and tried to get in-depth info and failed. Perhaps others have found newer information but I stopped looking several years back, after finding the product was not going to do what I wanted. Part of the discussion has always been whether this unit is actually a "dual stage" as it lacks the common signs we know make a dual stage. Without seeing drawings, we were unable to decide. Then we looked at other points where the information was available. The solenoid is one point which often fails us but we are only told that it is safe 12 volt operation without info on what level of current is used. Being the common "black box" design, overheating from using too much current has to be considered and you can certainly overheat things at 12 volts as you can at 110 volt if too much current is used! Perhaps a bogus claim but we don't know, due to a lack of information. We are told it will do a good job up to 40 PSI but looking at the working pressure meter, we see it reads 0-150 PSI which gives very poor resolution in the 0-40 PSI range. Why did they not use a better meter like 0-80 if the reg will only output 40? The bubble counter is a type which I do not want to use as it seems a really faulty idea to put liquid directly above the parts we want to keep dry and leave us to depend on a check valve to save us! The needle valve is an obvious low grade, common type, made of metal poured into a mold. This type metal is not strong and durable enough to allow fine quality machine work. The soft metal combined with a short stubby design does not allow for a long finely tapered needle, nor good fine threads to move the needle. Not the worst but certainly far from the best. So to sum up my thoughts? I see a product that has a niche in the market, will be useful at some points in our hobby, but not one that we should expect to serve us as a really high quality set that will give us fun for the long term. If you are shopping for a "starter set", it may fit what you want, but if looking for great quality, you may want to spend a bit more to get far better. I consider this unit to be just one of many options and I do not have a recommendation for any set that will fit everybody's situation. #1 · Oct 28, 2018 This is a somewhat new product as it has been around for 5-10 years but information has been hard to find in many cases, leaving us to rely only on the sales advertisements and "word of mouth" reviews. Since this is a product aimed at the lower end of the market, those reviews are often done by new users who may not fully understand some of what they are seeing and being a new product those reviews are often done before some of the faults show up. This is not to slam a product as unusable as it certainly has a place in the market, but I feel it worthwhile to know what we are buying and why it may/may not be as good as we first think. This, like all reviews, is strictly personal opinion but I will assure you that I do not have any money in the game, either for or against. I am reviewing the CO2 Art Dual stage Pro as currently advertised on a number of sites in the $125 US range. This is the site I will refer to, as it does give us a good clean view of the front of the product and it does make an easy place to start: https://www.aquariumcoop.com/products/co2-art-dual-stage-pro-regulator A number of the older users on the forum have looked at this product and tried to get in-depth info and failed. Perhaps others have found newer information but I stopped looking several years back, after finding the product was not going to do what I wanted. Part of the discussion has always been whether this unit is actually a "dual stage" as it lacks the common signs we know make a dual stage. Without seeing drawings, we were unable to decide. Then we looked at other points where the information was available. The solenoid is one point which often fails us but we are only told that it is safe 12 volt operation without info on what level of current is used. Being the common "black box" design, overheating from using too much current has to be considered and you can certainly overheat things at 12 volts as you can at 110 volt if too much current is used! Perhaps a bogus claim but we don't know, due to a lack of information. We are told it will do a good job up to 40 PSI but looking at the working pressure meter, we see it reads 0-150 PSI which gives very poor resolution in the 0-40 PSI range. Why did they not use a better meter like 0-80 if the reg will only output 40? The bubble counter is a type which I do not want to use as it seems a really faulty idea to put liquid directly above the parts we want to keep dry and leave us to depend on a check valve to save us! The needle valve is an obvious low grade, common type, made of metal poured into a mold. This type metal is not strong and durable enough to allow fine quality machine work. The soft metal combined with a short stubby design does not allow for a long finely tapered needle, nor good fine threads to move the needle. Not the worst but certainly far from the best. So to sum up my thoughts? I see a product that has a niche in the market, will be useful at some points in our hobby, but not one that we should expect to serve us as a really high quality set that will give us fun for the long term. If you are shopping for a "starter set", it may fit what you want, but if looking for great quality, you may want to spend a bit more to get far better. I consider this unit to be just one of many options and I do not have a recommendation for any set that will fit everybody's situation. See less See more Sort by Oldest first Oldest first Newest first Most reactions #2 · Oct 28, 2018 Following this discussion. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk #3 · Oct 28, 2018 I don`t believe we need a medical grade regulator in this hobby but a good grade needle valve is essential. #4 · Oct 28, 2018 i sometimes use the old term "pot metal" when speaking of the cheaper type needle valves and that has led to being asked what I mean. I am not sure where the term pot metal came from but I suspect it is from the old days when folks used a metal pot and melted lead for different uses like sealing lead pipes. In any case I find the term meaning a type of metal that is easy to melt and easy to pour and mold things like fishing sinkers and such that are not at all critical on the quality front. For the old guys who have poured lead, we know that there was little care given to what type of lead or other metal was used as all we wanted was quick and cheap, as we were not going to do any fine work like cutting threads or forming tiny, precise holes like a needle valve needs. So when I speak of pot metal, it doesn't mean any specific combination of metals like tin, lead, and silver, but I use it as a general term to define metal that is not meant to be fine quality, just whatever goes in the pot! #5 · Oct 28, 2018 I still hear the term “pot metal” (interchangeable with MIM or mold in metal) in the firearms hobby. It usually refers to small, ancillary parts such as slide stops, safeties, magazine releases, pins, etc. The better made, higher quality firearms almost always have quality machined parts whereas the less expensive ones have MIM if the parts are metal. I’ve found that this can be applied to other things like tools and metal parts for things like regulators. It doesn’t mean these parts don’t work, but they are typically of lesser quality that can negatively impact fit, finish, and even functionality. FWIW your observation of these needle valves being MIM appears accurate to me as well. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 0 Reply #6 · Oct 28, 2018 Needle valve It seems that the main item I would like to upgrade would be the needle valve. Do you have any recommendations on what valve to use? #7 · Oct 28, 2018

AguaScape said: It seems that the main item I would like to upgrade would be the needle valve. Do you have any recommendations on what valve to use? Click to expand...

I own the Pro-SE regulator (the exact one being discussed) and while the NV is a MIM part, my personal one holds its position and is capable of fairly fine adjustments with working pressure increased. I’m not sure if this is due to physics or the needle valve itself, or both. If I was going to upgrade, I’d probably spring for the Fabco everybody seems to love. I just wish it came chrome plated or in stainless steel to match the look of the regulator. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Show more replies 0 Reply #10 · Oct 29, 2018 So what does one really need to spend (U.S. $) for a top notch, quality, money is no object, last a lifetime regulator? #11 · Oct 29, 2018 Best answer I could give you on this would be to search for posts by AlanLe or Flowerfishs in the for sale section. They list high end complete regulators for sale on a regular basis. 2 Replies Insert Quotes Post Reply

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