2021 Order Dilemma - G550 Versus G63 - Forums

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G Class (W460, W461, W463) Produced 1980-2018: 290 GD, 290 GDT, 300 GD, 350 GD, 500 GE, G250, G300, G300 DT, G320, G500, G550, G55 AMG, G63 AMG Community Links Pictures & Albums Members Search Forums Show Threads Show Posts Tag Search Advanced Search Find All Liked Posts Go to Page... 2021 Order Dilemma - G550 versus G63 Reply Subscribe Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Old 07-11-2020 | 04:05 PM #1 Hodog16's Avatar Hodog16 Thread Starter MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,307 Likes: 601 From: NC 2024 G63 2021 Order Dilemma - G550 versus G63 I currently have a $1,000 refundable deposit down for a 2021 G550 allocation agreed at MSRP with a September build date. I have a purchase order number and everything's set and still green on the order bank. However, as my G550 build has increased in options, I've realized that I'm getting closer and closer to G63 territory. I really need to draw the line somewhere but wanted to get some feedback on what you all think. My G550 build is AMG night package + exclusive interior + seat comfort + adaptive suspension + 12.3" widescreen + all season floor mats + wheel locks. 2020 MSRP is $148,510. My G63 build is probably the worse ever, but I'm happy with just seat comfort + all season floor mats + wheel locks for a 2020 MSRP of $161,320, a $12,810 premium. I was going to paint the G550 calipers red anyway which is about $500 and takes effort/time, so mentally it's fair to say a $12,000 difference. Calling around today, I get the sense that it would be feasible but not guaranteed for me to get a G63 at MSRP by the spring or at least before the end of the 2021 model year. I'm perfectly fine waiting--I still love my Sport and more importantly I have an extended warranty until September 2021. I guess I'm looking for the pros/cons of the G550 versus G63 besides the obvious boost in HP, exhaust and surround cameras. Is it a lot more expensive to service the AMG and do maintenance items like brakes, etc? Does the G63 hold its value better over time? Is the G63 worth canceling a sure thing and having to wait longer and with some uncertainty? Other details - for the G550 I'd leave the brush guard and spare tire cover on since I would have paid for the night package. For the G63 I would probably take the brush guard off since covers are available and potentially get the adapter to turn the spare tire around and leave the spare tire cover off. Thanks for any insight! Reply Like Hodog16 View Public Profile Find More Posts by Hodog16 View iTrader Profile Old 07-11-2020 | 04:58 PM #2 DarrVao777's Avatar DarrVao777 Junior Member Joined: May 2011 Posts: 70 Likes: 20 '18 G550, '15 F82, ‘22 Taycan CT4 Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 I guess I'm looking for the pros/cons of the G550 versus G63 besides the obvious boost in HP, exhaust and surround cameras. Is it a lot more expensive to service the AMG and do maintenance items like brakes, etc? Does the G63 hold its value better over time? Is the G63 worth canceling a sure thing and having to wait longer and with some uncertainty? I was torn between the same decision and ultimately selected a 2018 G550 over the G63. At the time I was looking, our local dealer only had 1 G550 in stock. Of course, the day I came to an agreement with the dealership, 3 G63s got added to their inventory. I had a chance to back out of the deal but didn't. By the time I went to pick up my G550 2 weeks later, all 3 G63s had been sold. I love our car, but if I could go back, I would have selected the G63. The G550 is for my wife and she would not have appreciated the difference in HP/exhaust. I don't know if it is more expensive to service the AMG but it's expensive either way ($1200+ for the 20000 mile service which included oil and differential fluid change) I think the G63 does hold its value better over time as my dealership told me most buyers were looking at the G63 and not the G550 (I would guess that the thought process is, "If I'm spending so much already, why not go for the best?"). At the very least, the dealership was willing to negotiate with me over the G550 and wouldn't budge a penny on the G63s. As you could see above, all 3 G63s were spoken for within 3 weeks of hitting dealership inventory. Sorry, not the most satisfying answer, our G550 has been fantastic but if I could redo it, I would want the best possible G available which I think is the G63. Reply Like The following users liked this post: EJKaufman (08-06-2020) DarrVao777 View Public Profile Find More Posts by DarrVao777 View iTrader Profile Old 07-11-2020 | 06:36 PM #3 spourreza's Avatar spourreza Super Member Joined: Jan 2020 Posts: 551 Likes: 180 From: Nj mclaren 720s This is exact decision I went through!!! had a G550 on order, MSRP was 168k.... really wanted a G63 but didnt want to wait 2 years... I got very lucky and grabbed someone else’s G63 allocation with my exact spec I wanted. Now I have about 400 miles on car. The G63 cost almost $202k which included a 15k premium.... so the difference was about 35k... Honestly, the 550 is amazing but wow, the G63 is bonkers... You mentioned the HP, Exhaust etc... thats a big advantage but also the AMG feeling is one of a kind... Cant explain it... And the steering wheel!!! IMHO, neither decision is wrong... for me, speed and exhaust was very important.... so love my decision. AMG will hold its value better... at the cost of a 550 or G63... who really cars about service costs?? And, IMHO, the G63 wont sell for MSRP unless your dealer is on life support!!!! Last edited by spourreza; 07-11-2020 at 06:57 PM. Reply Like The following users liked this post: EJKaufman (08-06-2020) spourreza View Public Profile Find More Posts by spourreza View iTrader Profile Old 07-11-2020 | 07:36 PM #4 Hodog16's Avatar Hodog16 Thread Starter MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,307 Likes: 601 From: NC 2024 G63 DarrVao777: I appreciate the insight and thought process. If this were for my wife I would definitely go 550, but for me I would definitely appreciate the power and exhaust. spourreza: I'm lucky that the dealers here (with one exception) only ask for MSRP for G63 orders, but if there's a cancelled order and immediately available, then it's fair game for $15-30k over. Reply Like Hodog16 View Public Profile Find More Posts by Hodog16 View iTrader Profile Old 07-11-2020 | 08:59 PM #5 Bob Z.'s Avatar Bob Z. MBWorld Fanatic! iTrader: (1) Joined: Dec 2019 Posts: 2,176 Likes: 465 From: Marineland FL '25 EQG deposit, '23 MC20 Cielo, '20 Fat Boy Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 DarrVao777: I appreciate the insight and thought process. If this were for my wife I would definitely go 550, but for me I would definitely appreciate the power and exhaust. spourreza: I'm lucky that the dealers here (with one exception) only ask for MSRP for G63 orders, but if there's a cancelled order and immediately available, then it's fair game for $15-30k over. I ordered a G550 since I had to have the Zen wood steering wheel and it is an SUV and not a sports car so I am fine without the G63. If you decide to delete the spare tire I have the cover plate to cover the holes so drop me a PM if decide to do so. Reply Like Bob Z. View Public Profile Find More Posts by Bob Z. View iTrader Profile Old 07-11-2020 | 11:06 PM #6 HK Zhang's Avatar HK Zhang Junior Member Joined: May 2020 Posts: 72 Likes: 18 From: USA 2021 g63, 2020 BMW M340i, 2015 AUDI RS7 Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 DarrVao777: I appreciate the insight and thought process. If this were for my wife I would definitely go 550, but for me I would definitely appreciate the power and exhaust. spourreza: I'm lucky that the dealers here (with one exception) only ask for MSRP for G63 orders, but if there's a cancelled order and immediately available, then it's fair game for $15-30k over. For my experience to order a G63, some bigger network dealership usually asks an extra premium for G63, even for orders with 1 to 2 years wait. However, some individual family-owned dealership (where I ordered the G63) won't do that and they will sell the G63 at MSRP, the salesman told me he knows most of the dealership will ask premium but they won't do that. I left the refundable deposit last year in August and the order was in production last month, should be here in August. Reply Like HK Zhang View Public Profile Find More Posts by HK Zhang View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 01:32 AM #7 jamesszzz's Avatar jamesszzz Member Joined: Sep 2019 Posts: 137 Likes: 54 From: NYC G63s and a few others Easy - G63. Looks and drives better. Reply Like The following users liked this post: EJKaufman (08-06-2020)

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jamesszzz View Public Profile Find More Posts by jamesszzz View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 09:54 AM #8 spourreza's Avatar spourreza Super Member Joined: Jan 2020 Posts: 551 Likes: 180 From: Nj mclaren 720s Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 DarrVao777: I appreciate the insight and thought process. If this were for my wife I would definitely go 550, but for me I would definitely appreciate the power and exhaust. spourreza: I'm lucky that the dealers here (with one exception) only ask for MSRP for G63 orders, but if there's a cancelled order and immediately available, then it's fair game for $15-30k over. agree on getting an ordered car, you could get one at slightly higher than MSRP but issue on ordering a G63 is the long wait (about 2 years by me).... many don’t want to wait that long... I just got very lucky and my dream spec was sitting at the port from a customer who cancelled... hence why I pivoted.... The concern i always had with a 550 is the “man... I should have ordered the G63...” feeling! Like i said, no choice is wrong but if you get a 63, not wait two years and are satisfied with less options to bring it close to the 550 price, go with 63. IMHO Reply Like spourreza View Public Profile Find More Posts by spourreza View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 11:37 AM #9 Hodog16's Avatar Hodog16 Thread Starter MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,307 Likes: 601 From: NC 2024 G63 I ended up putting three refundable deposits down for a G63 allocation yesterday. One dealer I am second in line, another I am first in line, and the third does huge numbers and they are hoping to get me an allocation that would build in early 2021. We will see how it goes! In the meantime, I'm going to think about it some more this week but will likely cancel my G550 order, so I won't string that dealer along. The only options I'd be giving up is the night package on the 63 as everything on the 550 comes standard. One dealer was trying to convince me to add night package for resale because he said all G63 buyers want it. . . Last edited by Hodog16; 07-12-2020 at 11:40 AM. Reply Like Hodog16 View Public Profile Find More Posts by Hodog16 View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 11:57 AM #10 spourreza's Avatar spourreza Super Member Joined: Jan 2020 Posts: 551 Likes: 180 From: Nj mclaren 720s Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 I ended up putting three refundable deposits down for a G63 allocation yesterday. One dealer I am second in line, another I am first in line, and the third does huge numbers and they are hoping to get me an allocation that would build in early 2021. We will see how it goes! In the meantime, I'm going to think about it some more this week but will likely cancel my G550 order, so I won't string that dealer along. The only options I'd be giving up is the night package on the 63 as everything on the 550 comes standard. One dealer was trying to convince me to add night package for resale because he said all G63 buyers want it. . . unfortunately I agree with your dealer on night package... Reply Like spourreza View Public Profile Find More Posts by spourreza View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 01:29 PM #11 Hodog16's Avatar Hodog16 Thread Starter MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,307 Likes: 601 From: NC 2024 G63 Yeah I'm thinking of adding night package and the 21's but really this is getting ridiculous haha. I'm going to call a local powder coating place this week and see how much it would be to do the guard and the spare tire cover. Last edited by Hodog16; 07-12-2020 at 02:44 PM. Reply Like Hodog16 View Public Profile Find More Posts by Hodog16 View iTrader Profile Old 07-12-2020 | 02:22 PM #12 G-Dreaming's Avatar G-Dreaming Member Joined: Nov 2019 Posts: 100 Likes: 30 2020 G63, 2016 Range Rover LWB Quote: Originally Posted by spourreza unfortunately I agree with your dealer on night package... I actually do not agree. A lot depends on exterior color choice and of course personal preference. Night package although I like it (and Gs in all specs for that matter) may be overplayed on this vehicle which can ultimately make the spec less appealing. Reply Like G-Dreaming View Public Profile Find More Posts by G-Dreaming View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 06:28 PM #13 jcmd1978's Avatar jcmd1978 Newbie Joined: Jul 2020 Posts: 3 Likes: 0 G550 G550 is the better choice (Unless you are in the prestige game). It is not a daily driver for meI, so my purchase is more utilitarian.I would hate changing the tires for the winter if I get a G63. ( northEast). Great video here. You Tube Im not going for the night package.. the black trims makes the car "smaller" visually( according to my wife--she is always right about style)- so no night package for me. The softer ride is a plus for the G550. Remove the bush guard ASAP--really ugly. I prefer the horizontal slats of the G550( wider trick vs the vertical G63(taller trick). I cant justify the price difference of the two for what the driving experience offers. Im not tracking this truck. Im getting a 2021 South Sea Blue G550. Last edited by jcmd1978; 08-06-2020 at 06:32 PM. Reply Like jcmd1978 View Public Profile Find More Posts by jcmd1978 View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 06:34 PM #14 Bob Z.'s Avatar Bob Z. MBWorld Fanatic! iTrader: (1) Joined: Dec 2019 Posts: 2,176 Likes: 465 From: Marineland FL '25 EQG deposit, '23 MC20 Cielo, '20 Fat Boy I can afford either but I really like my G550 so far. I have the G63 side mufflers on it as well as the 22" Black wheels (thanks Chriag) and with the adaptive suspension it rides, sounds and looks great! And my wife got her Zen wood steering wheel, which is not an option on the G63, so it is perfect for us. Reply Like The following users liked this post: jcmd1978 (08-06-2020) Bob Z. View Public Profile Find More Posts by Bob Z. View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 06:45 PM #15 places's Avatar places MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Oct 2018 Posts: 3,315 Likes: 1,498 From: Washington DC No more MB:( If you can swing the 63 price it's a no brainer. It's a level up. Simple fact that a 550 can easily be had at msrp and the 63 still commands a premium or a long wait if ordered answers the question. Nothing like an AMG. Reply Like The following 2 users liked this post by places: EJKaufman (08-06-2020), jcmd1978 (08-06-2020) places View Public Profile Find More Posts by places View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 07:08 PM #16 jcmd1978's Avatar jcmd1978 Newbie Joined: Jul 2020 Posts: 3 Likes: 0 G550 Quote: Originally Posted by places If you can swing the 63 price it's a no brainer. It's a level up. Simple fact that a 550 can easily be had at msrp and the 63 still commands a premium or a long wait if ordered answers the question. Nothing like an AMG. paying a premium over MSRP for a G63 ( 20K over MSRP?) is not worth it in my opinion. I kept my 2009 G550 all this time, and paying a premium for a truck you intend to use for quite sometime is not wise... maybe if you intend to flip it. The AMG line package in the G550 makes it an AMG at least it looks like it.( flared fenders). The higher ground clearance is a plus for. the G550 for me as well. Reply Like jcmd1978 View Public Profile Find More Posts by jcmd1978 View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 07:10 PM #17 newyorktoLA's Avatar newyorktoLA MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,287 Likes: 120 2020 G63, 2021 E450 All-Terrain Wagon Quote: Originally Posted by Bob Z. I can afford either but I really like my G550 so far. I have the G63 side mufflers on it as well as the 22" Black wheels (thanks Chriag) and with the adaptive suspension it rides, sounds and looks great! And my wife got her Zen wood steering wheel, which is not an option on the G63, so it is perfect for us. Congrats on the new G! Post pictures!! And agreed - even with a G63, I actually like the looks of the G550 more... looks more true to the heritage of the car. Reply Like newyorktoLA View Public Profile Find More Posts by newyorktoLA View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 07:14 PM #18 Bob Z.'s Avatar Bob Z. MBWorld Fanatic! iTrader: (1) Joined: Dec 2019 Posts: 2,176 Likes: 465 From: Marineland FL '25 EQG deposit, '23 MC20 Cielo, '20 Fat Boy Quote: Originally Posted by places If you can swing the 63 price it's a no brainer. It's a level up. Simple fact that a 550 can easily be had at msrp and the 63 still commands a premium or a long wait if ordered answers the question. Nothing like an AMG. My G550 interior is identical to what can be ordered in the G63 (except for the Zen wood wheel that cannot be ordered in the G63) so waiting a lot longer and paying more for a more powerful engine and bigger brakes made it a no brainer for me to order the G550. There is nothing wrong with buying either and if one likes one over the other so be it. Last edited by Bob Z.; 08-06-2020 at 07:17 PM. Reply Like Bob Z. View Public Profile Find More Posts by Bob Z. View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 07:22 PM #19 spourreza's Avatar spourreza Super Member Joined: Jan 2020 Posts: 551 Likes: 180 From: Nj mclaren 720s i was in the 550 camp until i test drove the G63... its worlds of difference... its a much better ride. The AMG features are nuts, the brakes are great and the engine alone is worth it. Sport plus is bunkers. not worried about winter as i have trail package. sorry but after driving the 550 and then owning the 63, even $50k delta would justify it. both are great choices for sure but the 63 is pure insanity. i actually felt that the 550 was way too underpowered for me. to each its own. that said, 63 is very high in demand and will hold value much better. its just flawless Reply Like The following users liked this post: places (08-06-2020) spourreza View Public Profile Find More Posts by spourreza View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 09:47 PM #20 EJKaufman's Avatar EJKaufman Member Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 220 Likes: 58 From: Miami, FL 2021 Night Black Magno G63 Quote: Originally Posted by Hodog16 I currently have a $1,000 refundable deposit down for a 2021 G550 allocation agreed at MSRP with a September build date. I have a purchase order number and everything's set and still green on the order bank. However, as my G550 build has increased in options, I've realized that I'm getting closer and closer to G63 territory. I really need to draw the line somewhere but wanted to get some feedback on what you all think. My G550 build is AMG night package + exclusive interior + seat comfort + adaptive suspension + 12.3" widescreen + all season floor mats + wheel locks. 2020 MSRP is $148,510. My G63 build is probably the worse ever, but I'm happy with just seat comfort + all season floor mats + wheel locks for a 2020 MSRP of $161,320, a $12,810 premium. I was going to paint the G550 calipers red anyway which is about $500 and takes effort/time, so mentally it's fair to say a $12,000 difference. Calling around today, I get the sense that it would be feasible but not guaranteed for me to get a G63 at MSRP by the spring or at least before the end of the 2021 model year. I'm perfectly fine waiting--I still love my Sport and more importantly I have an extended warranty until September 2021. I guess I'm looking for the pros/cons of the G550 versus G63 besides the obvious boost in HP, exhaust and surround cameras. Is it a lot more expensive to service the AMG and do maintenance items like brakes, etc? Does the G63 hold its value better over time? Is the G63 worth canceling a sure thing and having to wait longer and with some uncertainty? Other details - for the G550 I'd leave the brush guard and spare tire cover on since I would have paid for the night package. For the G63 I would probably take the brush guard off since covers are available and potentially get the adapter to turn the spare tire around and leave the spare tire cover off. Thanks for any insight! For a $12K difference if you can order a G63 at msrp I’d definitely go with the 63. Looks better, more fun to drive, and holds its value better. Both come with a 4 year 50K mile factory warranty (and you can extend both). You can also buy the 4 year prepaid maintenance on the 63 for $2850, which will save you a decent amount of $. I’m doing this on my 21 G63 with November build date. I was in a similar position in 2012. I had a Ferrari 458 Italia coupe and was getting a G Wagen as my daily driver. I ordered a 2013 G550 bc I figured I already had the 458 for speed and then used the savings to trick out my truck with 24” Forgiato wheels, blacking out all the chrome on the car and all the lights, etc. I loved my truck and still do (I’m keeping it until right before my 63 comes in and will then put it up for sale) but I always sort of wished I got the 63 for about 20-25k more back then. I knew when the new body style G would come out that I would definitely switch it up and go for the 63 next time, the big dog model. I’ve gotten over my exotic sports car phase and just keep 1 car now so I will always go for the 63 going forward. I expect to be a G63 lifer getting a new model each time it’s redesigned. Also, I hate the brush guard on the new 550’s, I think it’s hideous. If you do go for a 550 then I’d def take the brush guard off and either don’t have one or add the G63 lower brush guard as it’s much more aesthetic. If the $ difference doesn’t matter I think it’s an easy decision! Last edited by EJKaufman; 08-06-2020 at 09:52 PM. Reply Like EJKaufman View Public Profile Find More Posts by EJKaufman View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 11:05 PM #21 spourreza's Avatar spourreza Super Member Joined: Jan 2020 Posts: 551 Likes: 180 From: Nj mclaren 720s Quote: Originally Posted by Bob Z. My G550 interior is identical to what can be ordered in the G63 (except for the Zen wood wheel that cannot be ordered in the G63) so waiting a lot longer and paying more for a more powerful engine and bigger brakes made it a no brainer for me to order the G550. There is nothing wrong with buying either and if one likes one over the other so be it. true except the steering wheel options on G63 changes the look of the interior imho. very sporty. Reply Like spourreza View Public Profile Find More Posts by spourreza View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 11:15 PM #22 jcmd1978's Avatar jcmd1978 Newbie Joined: Jul 2020 Posts: 3 Likes: 0 G550 Agree, the G63 is crazy. 167 more HP, 300 pounds heavier ,stiffer suspension, bigger brakes vs G550. But most people would really not drive this truck near its road limits. Long stopping distances, overturning risk on the road argues against getting more power than needed. Its primarily an off road design. The G550 is a better performer off road. The engine is basically the same,.. with more turbo boost as the primary reason for the increased power, in the G63. Somehow this may mean more potential for increased engine wear. G63 is a prestige version of the G Class line. For me the G550 is just fine, Dont need faster acceleration or top speed in this segment. The summer performance stock tires on the G63 tells its philosophy. A truck wanting to become a muscle car, of sorts....not for me. Reply Like jcmd1978 View Public Profile Find More Posts by jcmd1978 View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 11:15 PM #23 Bob Z.'s Avatar Bob Z. MBWorld Fanatic! iTrader: (1) Joined: Dec 2019 Posts: 2,176 Likes: 465 From: Marineland FL '25 EQG deposit, '23 MC20 Cielo, '20 Fat Boy Quote: Originally Posted by spourreza true except the steering wheel options on G63 changes the look of the interior imho. very sporty. I wanted the Zen wood steering wheel and that is not offered on the G63 - nice to have options that can please us all! Reply Like The following users liked this post: spourreza (08-06-2020) Bob Z. View Public Profile Find More Posts by Bob Z. View iTrader Profile Old 08-06-2020 | 11:38 PM #24 Hodog16's Avatar Hodog16 Thread Starter MBWorld Fanatic! Joined: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,307 Likes: 601 From: NC 2024 G63 Thanks for the input everybody. To give you an update on things, I actually called my dealer the day I did my original post (a Saturday) and told them I was leaning towards going for a G63 instead. At the time my G550 build was still green. The original dealer told me that the G63 wait was a long time and recommended I get the G550 and put an order in later for a G63. I ended up deciding over that weekend just to go straight for a G63 and called them back on Monday. My sales person was fine putting me on their list, but later that day called and told me that Graf had locked the order in without any notice. They gave me a choice to walk but were hopeful I would stay with the G550 order which is still being built next month. I waffled initially but currently have requests/deposits down for a G63 at MSRP at a few dealers. I am hopeful that I will get a purchase order in the spring provided there are no more shutdowns. I've told the original dealer to give me a call when the vehicle arrives, but honestly I'm willing to wait an extra 6 months to get the G63 since this is a vehicle I'm going to keep for a long time, so the extra wait will be worth it. The plan is for the G63 to be my DD which is currently a RR Sport with the V8, so I think the G63's acceleration will be more in line with what I'm used to. As for the G63 I've since decided to either add night package + 21's or go with silver 22's. Not interested in night package and 22's. At any rate, I have plenty of time to decide. Last edited by Hodog16; 08-06-2020 at 11:41 PM. Reply Like The following users liked this post: places (08-07-2020) Hodog16 View Public Profile Find More Posts by Hodog16 View iTrader Profile Reply Subscribe Back to Subforum G Class (W460, W461, W463) View Next Unread need help to score a g63 at msrp Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) Thread Tools Show Printable Version Show Printable Version Search this Thread Advanced Search Rate This Thread Excellent Excellent Good Good Average Average Bad Bad Terrible Terrible Rate Thread You have already rated this thread Rating: Thread Rating: 0 votes,  average. Thread Tools Show Printable Version Email this Page Advanced Search Reply Closed Thread Share
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