Altair (Re:Creators) Upgrade To 1-A | VS Battles Wiki Forum
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- Content Revision
- Thread starter Thread starter Orion'sBow
- Start date Start date Dec 28, 2018
- Tags Tags altair (re:creators) re:creators tiering system
Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 After watching Re:Creators several times and reading up about it, I've come to the conclusion that Altair should be 1-A. To be 1-A (Outerversal), a character must meet several qualifications, which Altair does. Re:Creators is a massive world, and Altair can do virtually anything she pleases in it by the end of the series. I will provide scans to back my my statements up. The Human part of Re:Creators is the part of the world which creates the stories https://imgur.com/a/qohFx80. Every story is a fully formed world, and every different version of canon is a divergent timeline/universe https://imgur.com/a/1lWKqzK This even includes any creative imagination of humanity https://imgur.com/a/G6MgAYQ https://imgur.com/a/r9iwIys. Logically, a world formed with every imagination of humanity as a universe (At least) would be very large in size, Hyperverse at smallest. Altair, who had multiple stories and canons making her up in the start (An ever growing number, technically making her multidimensional on a large scale), managed to transcend the massive dimensional barrier between fiction/reality and be able to exist outside of her stories https://imgur.com/a/fBU9n9I, making her existence, which is composed of an infinitely growing amount of people's wills, thoughts, and imaginations (Thus dimensions), nearly boundless https://imgur.com/mZuJqqp https://imgur.com/XtgRZao https://imgur.com/1YvpDc2. In the end of the story, she transcends even the beliefs in her by creating her own story and cosmos https://imgur.com/a/PBE6wS6 which transcends the human one https://imgur.com/a/ypx1OFW, thus removing herself from any law of causality which would bind her, and transcending past the concept of dimensional measurement. Her power in the universes is great as well. Altair can travel between the fictional and real worlds at will https://imgur.com/4uJMt0w, and pull out any character she likes from them, even from different versions (She pulled anime Selesia, and novel Charon https://imgur.com/Dmtbp2y.) Altair's physical power may not be great, but she makes up for it in almost unparalleled hax. She can erase objects, and depower people https://imgur.com/a/ufBZn7U. She can turn people or objects into flowers. She can duplicate people, objects, the laws that accompany them, and make them work in her favor. The only way to affect her is to target her concept https://imgur.com/a/WTbJl02, and she has shaken those attempts off easily. She uses probability manipulation to escape from attacks that would destroy/render her unable to fight in any way https://imgur.com/a/el9XFba. She creates her own plot when she enters combat https://imgur.com/9BsxD07, allowing her to manipulate it at will, such as by undoing plot changes for characters, erasing their plots entirely https://imgur.com/a/C5bPUSz, or writing new plots for them to follow. Altair's power is also almost impossible, if not impossible, for other characters to hax/stop https://imgur.com/a/0TB0NeT (They would need to exceed her in universe approval, which is nigh impossible.) So, how does this all mean that Altair should be 1-A Outerversal? Let's Review. We've seen that stories, thoughts, and imaginations make up the Re:Creators world, making it immensely vast. Altair is the embodiment of multiple of these stories, making her a multidimensional being even before the end. At the end, she can casually influence or destroy the world below her as she sees fit, and she has created a world which transcends its limitations, as she does. Altair's ridiculous hax make her insanely powerful in combat. A limitless being with this much power over a imitless region should not logically be anything but 1-A. Myths 1: Altair could be defeated by removing her from anyone who believed in her BFR style. This would not work, even on pre EoS Altair. She was trapped in a conceptual, dimensional barrier by Selesia https://imgur.com/PRc5cPF, which cut her off from the rest of the world, and she still had access to all her powers https://imgur.com/BpbJ2Ef. 2: Altair's powers only affect the Creations. The powers of the Holopsicon are clearly shown to have an effect on the real world by damaging it https://imgur.com/a/zeEFwsl. Hence, coupled with the fact that she creates plots whenever she gets into fights, this claim has no basis. 3: Altair could be speedblitzed/nuked by X character. Altair's hax make her virtually invulerable to most opponents, physical strength notwithstanding. In conclusion, based on rewatching the show carefully, studying it, and viewing other's solid opinions of it, I have come to the conclusion that pre Eos Altair is a 1-C Hyperversal Hax Monster, and that Eos Altair is a 1-A Outerversal Hax Goddess. I leave you all with this meme. https://imgur.com/a/dBhgV4O Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 Ignore everything at the bottom, my cat messed with my keyboard.
WHYNAUT
Messages 9,050 Reaction score 1,053 You can edit it.
Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 Here are some of the less frequently asked staff members that you can select from to ask to give input: Promestein SomebodyData Darkanine Reppuzan Dragonmasterxyz Celestial Pegasus Monarch Laciel Assaltwaffle Saikou The Lewd King Antoniofer Gemmysaur PaChi2 Ultima Reality DarkDragonMedeus AKM Sama Dargoo Faust MrKingOfNegativity Wokistan
Iapitus_The_Impaler
Messages 16,623 Reaction score 1,795 >Checks Board >Isnt fun and games Oh Boy Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12WHYNAUT said: You can edit it. Click to expand...I didn't notice that because I spent almost 6 hours doing this and lost all my sleep lol...
Paul_Frank
VS Battles Retired Messages 9,533 Reaction score 1,835 Following I guess
Marquis_Samigina
Messages 78 Reaction score 97 That's some Firepheonixearl's level shit right here. Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 So should we close this? Paul_Frank
VS Battles Retired Messages 9,533 Reaction score 1,835 Yes
ZacharyGrossman273
Messages 24,177 Reaction score 3,892
Tony_di_bugalu
Messages 9,969 Reaction score 3,763Antvasima said: So should we close this? Click to expand...Just give time for the knowledgeable member to debunk his reasoning and correct him.
Extreme123dz
Messages 1,239 Reaction score 83 Before someone closes this, can anyone argue (and bring proof) why this does not work? outside the "common logic" or the "Ad Populum"? Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 Okay. I will wait. You can use the Re:Creators page to find knowledgeable members to ask to comment here. Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12Extreme123dz said: Before someone closes this, can anyone argue (and bring proof) why this does not work? outside the "common logic" or the "Ad Populum"? Click to expand...I am curious, how does this not work? I believe that I effectively showed how Altair is transdimensional via in-series logic.
WHYNAUT
Messages 9,050 Reaction score 1,053 The tiers on this wiki don't go by in-series logic tho, they go by feats and scaling. I don't know anything about re:creators so that's all I'll say. Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 Re:Creators is a massive verse formed of countless dimensions which Altair can manipulate. She also transcends its boundaries in the end, making her Outerversal. By "In-Series Logic" I was referring to Re:Creators' Cosmology. It's like how we use the Cosmology of series like the Masadaverse, DC Universe, WTC Verse, etc. to explain how the characters/settings are Outerversal. I would also recommend checking out Re:Creators; It's a great series in my opinion. Paul_Frank
VS Battles Retired Messages 9,533 Reaction score 1,835 Countless =/= infinite Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 True. To Clarify, the normal/human Re:Creators verse has a countless amount of dimensions. It is not infinite, and I have never claimed it is. However, Altair isn't a part of that in the end. As I stated previously, the fact that Altair is a sentient being formed of so many stories (Which are dimensions in Re:Creators) makes the baseline version of her a multidimensional being, but in the end she leaves the normal world behind to become a story she creates herself. That's what I meant by Altair transcending it's boundaries. She doesn't exist in the normal part which is finite anymore. This makes Altair an acausal being who is beyond the concept of dimensional measurement, and all worlds she creates that way as well. She is also proven to have control over both sets of worlds, her own and the normal one beneath hers. I suppose the best way to understand it would be to think of two circles, with one on top of the other. The one beneath is the human world, and from its center, all the other stories emerge. The circle above it is Altair's world, which is acausal, infinite, even more complex, and ruled over by her directly. To be with Setsuna and save the world, Altair left the lower one behind to create the higher one, but she still has authority over the one beneath her. Baseline Altair is multiversal at lowest, with the ability to manipulate a hyperverse. EoS Altair is outerversal who can affect a hyperverse beneath her, and an outerverse around her.
Overlord4896
Messages 512 Reaction score 52 this seems multiversal at best to me at least. it is never exactly shown that she transcends the concept of dimensions. she also states that she would create a whole other universe but that universe probably doesnt suprass the concept of dimensions. i agree with an upgrade to 2A but nothing more much less 1A.
Setsuna_tenma
Messages 11,392 Reaction score 5,266 infinite dimensions were not shown in the verse and neither were High 1-B and 1A verses as stories in the verse. Overlord4896
Messages 512 Reaction score 52 i completly agree with with setsuna. it also doesnt make sense for these stories to be higher dimensional than thier original creator universe (the human world in the anime) as that would mean the characters from those stories should transcdend their original creators universe by whatever higher dimension they are which they do not as the orginial universe has practically complete control over these stories so it safe to assume they are all of the third dimension. otherwise we will have to assume that the original universe is higher than 3D which it clearly 100% isnt. even when altair created that universe of hers it was never stated to be higher dimensional at all, infact it looked like a normal 3D universe which she can create an infinite amount off but would require an infinite amount of time to do so. so in this case low 2C completely makes sense for her character and no upgrade should be taken place, espically the 1A upgrade which is really far-fetched. Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 >Altair's stories aren't infinite https://imgur.com/a/EnTWfSM. >No higher dimensional characters than 3D ones exist in the human world A Multidimensional Hound of Tindalos exists in it. https://imgur.com/a/HYoB4P8. The Verse it came from is higher than 3D, so this claim is destroyed by canon. Also, the story is all about worlds where different laws break into the human one and cause it to shatter. This includes higher dimensional stuff like the Hound of Tindalos. >None of this qualifies her as dimensionally boundless. She's unbound by any of the laws that affect the lower verse or its multiple dimensions, and has gone from an Endless Story (Infinitely Expanding Dimensional Being) to an Infinite Story (Infinite Dimensional Being). She can also destroy the lower world at will, and can create an infinite world for herself. Idunno, having that much hax, dimensional tiering, and dimensional authority seem like pretty good qualifications for being 1-A https://imgur.com/a/FV1N8h3. Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 The word "dimensions" inaccurately used as a synonym for stories usually means that they are separate universes, not higher-dimensional realms, and even if there were countless spatial dimensions, trancending them would usually just mean "countless + 1" dimensions, unless it has clearly been proven that a character possesses a qualitative superiority to all degrees of time and space/the concept of dimensions themselves.
Monarch_Laciel
VS Battles Retired Messages 21,785 Reaction score 4,826 Agreed with Ant.
Celestial_Pegasus
VS Battles Administrator Messages 20,408 Reaction score 8,113 What even is this thread? Even if you highball altair she would be 6-D, 1-A Atair is such a high rating, i can't even fathom it. Stories just means universes, not higher dimensions, and even if they were, transcending them still wouldn't make her 1-A. This all fall apart from the very beginning where it's assumed that every story humans created are hyperversal which has never been stated in story, and what exists are merely numerous universes. Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12 Ruling an infinite story she effortlessly made puts her above the concepts of time, space, and dimensions. Celestial_Pegasus
VS Battles Administrator Messages 20,408 Reaction score 8,113 No. Story just means universe, this doesn't make her 1-A. Only time any sort of higher dimensionsal stuff is mentioned is with the hound being 5-D, and even if i indulge you and say every story created is 5-D, and countless or even infinite 5-D stories exist, Altair would still be very far from 1-A. It has never been stated that Altair transcends dimensions on a qualitative level. Orion'sBow
Messages 135 Reaction score 12Celestial Pegasus said: What even is this thread? Even if you highball altair she would be 6-D, 1-A Atair is such a high rating, i can't even fathom it. Stories just means universes, not higher dimensions, and even if they were, transcending them still wouldn't make her 1-A. This all fall apart from the very beginning where it's assumed that every story humans created are hyperversal which has never been stated in story, and what exists are merely numerous universes. Click to expand...I said that the Human World was a Hyperverse because of the endless nature and the high dimensional nature of the worlds inside it, not that each story was. Altair straight up transcends all the dimensions below her. She is a living story, so a universe, but with each art/canon added to her, her nature became more and more multiversal. When she becomes infinite by creating her infinite world, she has transcended the concepts of dimensions because the amount of universes (Stories) that make her up then are unquantifiable, since she exists as an infinite story who rules over an infinite existence which exists because she wants it to. Altair isn't bound by anything anymore, and the ending makes that pretty clear.
Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 I agree with Celestial Pegasus. We should probably close this thread. Celestial_Pegasus
VS Battles Administrator Messages 20,408 Reaction score 8,113 @Orion The stories are just universes, never been stated to be higher dimensionsal, and again even if they were still wouldn't make Altair 1-A. Altair doesn't transcend all dimensions, only thing she transcended was the yoke of her world, making her a character without a background, thus she gains the abilities that people add to anything with her in it, this isn't 1-A. All that happens at the end of the series is Altair became able to create universes/stories, nothing is stated about her transcending the concept of dimensions altogether. @Ant I agree. Antvasima
Maintenance worker
He/Him VS Battles Head Bureaucrat Bureaucrat Administrator Messages 175,502 Reaction score 87,447 Okay. I will close this then. Status Not open for further replies.Similar threads
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