Focus Speed And Accuracy Of M50 Mark II Vs. M6 Mark II?
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All forumsCanon EOS M TalkChange forum Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? Started Sep 10, 2021 | Discussions
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Greetings - first time poster. I have a M6, and love this as my travel camera, getting the same sensor as my 80D in such a small package is great. My problem is focus performance of the M6 is very poor compared to my 80D. As a travel camera I use the M6 for everything from landscapes to wildlife and birds. It seems the 1 spot auto focus area of the M6 is so large it misses focus on the subject, for example birds with leaves and branches nearby. I've tried manual focusing in these situations but always seem to miss the "shot" fumbling with focus. Maybe it's my method but the 80D works great for me, so I blame the camera ;). I'm thinking of getting something with better focus capability, I would appreciate getting feedback on focus performance of the M50 II and if possible compare to the M6 II. I've read quite a bit on how good the M6 II is but little on the M50 II. Thanks.
Fandor's gear list:Fandor's gear list Canon EOS 80D Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Sigma 35mm F1.4 DG HSM Art +8 more Canon EOS 80D Canon EOS M50 (EOS Kiss M) Canon EOS M6 If you believe there are incorrect tags, please send us this post using our feedback form. Compare these cameras Reply to thread Reply with quote Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Fandor • Sep 10, 2021Fandor wrote:
Greetings - first time poster. I have a M6, and love this as my travel camera, getting the same sensor as my 80D in such a small package is great. My problem is focus performance of the M6 is very poor compared to my 80D. As a travel camera I use the M6 for everything from landscapes to wildlife and birds. It seems the 1 spot auto focus area of the M6 is so large it misses focus on the subject, for example birds with leaves and branches nearby. I've tried manual focusing in these situations but always seem to miss the "shot" fumbling with focus. Maybe it's my method but the 80D works great for me, so I blame the camera ;). I'm thinking of getting something with better focus capability, I would appreciate getting feedback on focus performance of the M50 II and if possible compare to the M6 II. I've read quite a bit on how good the M6 II is but little on the M50 II. Thanks.
Canon M50 mark II eye-AF better than M6 mark II?: Canon EOS M Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review (dpreview.com)
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain
Alastair Norcross • Forum Pro • Posts: 11,120 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Fandor • Sep 11, 2021 3 The focus speed and accuracy of the M6II is as good as it gets, short of the R5 and R6. In some respects, it's better than the original R, even with updated firmware, and in others not quite as good (the R picks up eyes from further away), but all around I would say it's on a par. I have the M6 as well, and was quite happy with its AF, but definitely appreciate the improvements in the M6II. As for the size of the spot focus on the M6, have you tried the smaller spot size? You are not limited to the large focus spot.
-- hide signature --As the length of a thread approaches 150, the probability that someone will make the obvious "it's not the camera, it's the photographer" remark approaches 1.Alastairhttp://anorcross.smugmug.comEquipment in profile
Alastair Norcross's gear list:Alastair Norcross's gear list Canon G7 X II Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R7 Canon EOS R6 Mark II Canon RF 35mm F1.8 IS STM Macro +31 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain R2D2 • Forum Pro • Posts: 29,090 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Fandor • Sep 11, 2021 1Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
-- hide signature --Good judgment comes from experience.Experience comes from bad judgment.http://www.pbase.com/jekyll_and_hyde/galleries
R2D2's gear list:R2D2's gear list Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R5 Canon EOS R6 Mark II Canon EOS R5 II Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain OP Fandor • New Member • Posts: 11 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to MAC • Sep 12, 2021MAC wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Greetings - first time poster. I have a M6, and love this as my travel camera, getting the same sensor as my 80D in such a small package is great. My problem is focus performance of the M6 is very poor compared to my 80D. As a travel camera I use the M6 for everything from landscapes to wildlife and birds. It seems the 1 spot auto focus area of the M6 is so large it misses focus on the subject, for example birds with leaves and branches nearby. I've tried manual focusing in these situations but always seem to miss the "shot" fumbling with focus. Maybe it's my method but the 80D works great for me, so I blame the camera ;). I'm thinking of getting something with better focus capability, I would appreciate getting feedback on focus performance of the M50 II and if possible compare to the M6 II. I've read quite a bit on how good the M6 II is but little on the M50 II. Thanks.
Canon M50 mark II eye-AF better than M6 mark II?: Canon EOS M Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review (dpreview.com)
MAC - Thanks for the link, that was an adventure to read through
Fandor's gear list:Fandor's gear list Canon EOS 80D Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Sigma 35mm F1.4 DG HSM Art +8 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain OP Fandor • New Member • Posts: 11 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Fandor • Sep 12, 2021 1Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
Fandor's gear list:Fandor's gear list Canon EOS 80D Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Sigma 35mm F1.4 DG HSM Art +8 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain EDWARD ARTISTE • Regular Member • Posts: 250 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Alastair Norcross • Sep 12, 2021Alastair Norcross wrote:
The focus speed and accuracy of the M6II is as good as it gets, short of the R5 and R6. In some respects, it's better than the original R, even with updated firmware, and in others not quite as good (the R picks up eyes from further away), but all around I would say it's on a par. I have the M6 as well, and was quite happy with its AF, but definitely appreciate the improvements in the M6II. As for the size of the spot focus on the M6, have you tried the smaller spot size? You are not limited to the large focus spot.
I'm debating this at the moment. So many reviews and such touted the AF of this body, but im not seeing it in action. I have old rebels and my workhorse M1 that is way more reliable in terms of focus, regardless of af speed. Its a great body (so many button options!), but its been a headache with the m6mkii as a whole.I'm on my second M62 (first new, then refurb replacement). The focus was very busted except for literally one single day it worked great with an adapted 24-105.I just did some basic, easy object testing around the house. With this second one, the af is closer to normal, but im still getting really bizarre hit/miss performance.
I'm guessing the shutter slap is the culprit, but im seeing variation on electronic also (electronic shutter is generally performing better at 100% view). A 4ft distance at 2.5, trying various drive modes and its just bizarrely not hitting correctly at a high rate. The focused images and non focused is night and day, and i don't understand it.Lastly, as someone else posted, the colors in lightroom are...not great. I'm trying go do some real world testing (landscape) this evening, and will report back in.
-- hide signature --'Only the dead have seen the end of war'
EDWARD ARTISTE's gear list:EDWARD ARTISTE's gear list Canon PowerShot G12 Canon EOS 450D Canon EOS 550D Canon EOS 5D Mark III Canon EOS M +14 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain RLight • Veteran Member • Posts: 5,623 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Fandor • Sep 13, 2021 4Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
RLight's gear list:RLight's gear list Canon G5 X II Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R3 Canon EOS R5 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM +12 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to RLight • Sep 13, 2021RLight wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
gosh, I knew you'd miss it, but how can you resist it????
m6II + M32 + DXO Pl4 Elite with Deep Prime + DXO Film Pack + 430RT + EL-1 on stand with magmods -- slam dunk more practical, way less expensive, you need OCF light, lighter, and more fun than the R3 brick
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain thunder storm • Forum Pro • Posts: 11,655 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to R2D2 • Sep 13, 2021R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well, but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
-- hide signature --I love 50mm (equivalence)
thunder storm's gear list:thunder storm's gear list Canon EOS 6D Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R5 Sony a7 IV Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM +24 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to thunder storm • Sep 13, 2021thunder storm wrote:
R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well,
the sigma 18-35 is a PJ lens for what you like to shoot
You have high standards
lenses matter though, not just the body
but you can't blame the body alone -- it is not apples and apples unless you use the same lens:
your EF 24-70 F2.8 II @ 50 mm on the R and then using this same lens at 35 mm on the m6II would give a clearer story
but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
my guess is that a high speed lens like the EF 85 f1.8 would do just fine
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
USM Nano > USM > STM
it is not the body alone that needs considered
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain thunder storm • Forum Pro • Posts: 11,655 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to MAC • Sep 13, 2021MAC wrote:
thunder storm wrote:
R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well,
the sigma 18-35 is a PJ lens for what you like to shoot
You have high standards
lenses matter though, not just the body
but you can't blame the body alone
That's why I'm mentioning the lenses.
-- hide signature --it is not apples and apples unless you use the same lens:
your EF 24-70 F2.8 II @ 50 mm on the R and then using this same lens at 35 mm on the m6II would give a clearer story
I see your point and agree with it to some extend. However, it's never apples to apples. Either the DOF is different - unless you stop down the full frame camera - or the field of view.....
but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
my guess is that a high speed lens like the EF 85 f1.8 would do just fine
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
USM Nano > USM > STM
it is not the body alone that needs considered
My point point is: The focusing method matters too. Lenses focusing fast/accurate enough using single-AF point can be come a hair too slow or otherwise slightly inaccurate using subject tracking. I don't know if fast lenses are simply compensating for an added lag or if there's something else going on. But I do know the M6II + sigma 56mm f/1.4 is less accurate using subject tracking than the R5 + RF 85mm f/2.0 (even though the 56mm could focus faster...). If the 85mm picks the background over the subject you 're completely lost for 2 seconds or so, but otherwise, if it succeeds to track the subject it's a full 100% accurate, whereas the M6II + sigma 56mm f/1.4 will give you quite some slightly misfocused results. Yes, that's according to my personal maybe pretty high standards, but the difference is noticeable. You could also argue it's not me setting the bar high, but the 32Mp pixel count. Even though you could probably sell those slightly misfocused shots to a client, in my opinion an AF system should be able to keep up with the sensor resolution.
There where a lot of complaints about the M50II being "just an M50 with firmware upgrade." I would definitely LOVE to see a firmware upgrade for the M6III, as that flip up screen is very nice to use with subject tracking. Right now I'm ending up with the R5 + heavy lenses and that clumsy and fiddly "flip-half-way-turn-around-flip-further-remove-the-strap-from-getting-squeezed-between-the-body-and-screen-and-try-to-work-around-that-evf-sensor-screen" sometimes for those lower angle shots just because the R5 is 100% reliable using the subject tracking method.
-- hide signature --I love 50mm (equivalence)
thunder storm's gear list:thunder storm's gear list Canon EOS 6D Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R5 Sony a7 IV Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM +24 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain R2D2 • Forum Pro • Posts: 29,090 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to thunder storm • Sep 13, 2021 3thunder storm wrote:
R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well, but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
Agree. The only case that I’ve ever recommended using Face/Eye tracking with the M6ii is when the subject is close (like fill the frame close!).
If a person has followed my recommendations and instead uses Spot AF for EVERYTHING, then they’re golden. I’ve spent almost threee years now demonstrating exactly this. Otherwise they shoot at their peril!
R2
-- hide signature --Good judgment comes from experience.Experience comes from bad judgment.http://www.pbase.com/jekyll_and_hyde/galleries
R2D2's gear list:R2D2's gear list Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R5 Canon EOS R6 Mark II Canon EOS R5 II Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain
Alexis • Senior Member • Posts: 2,024 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to MAC • Sep 13, 2021 2 MAC wrote:
RLight wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
gosh, I knew you'd miss it, but how can you resist it????
m6II + M32 + DXO Pl4 Elite with Deep Prime + DXO Film Pack + 430RT + EL-1 on stand with magmods -- slam dunk more practical, way less expensive, you need OCF light, lighter, and more fun than the R3 brick
IF ONLY it had a built-in EVF I'd buy one in a millisecond. For now M50 all the way!
-- hide signature --http://www.alexisimages.comhttp://alexis.smugmug.comhttp://www.pbase.com/alexis
Alexis's gear list:Alexis's gear list Canon EOS 50D Canon EOS M50 II GoPro Hero9 Black Sigma 17-50mm F2.8 EX DC OS HSM Canon EF-M 11-22mm f/4-5.6 IS STM +12 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain thunder storm • Forum Pro • Posts: 11,655 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to R2D2 • Sep 13, 2021R2D2 wrote:
thunder storm wrote:
R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well, but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
Agree. The only case that I’ve ever recommended using Face/Eye tracking with the M6ii is when the subject is close (like fill the frame close!).
If a person has followed my recommendations and instead uses Spot AFfor EVERYTHING, then they’re golden. I’ve spent almost threee years now demonstrating exactly this. Otherwise they shoot at their peril!
R2
I know. But it's 2021. I want my camera to do that for me, especially when there's some subject motion.
I'm not sure if the 50-100mm suffers from the same kind of "problems", as filling the frame with the subject is what I'm naturally doing with that lens, so even if it does, it's less of a problem for me. But as we all know that 50-100mm isn't a very compact lens. And the 56mm + M6II not being capable of good subject tracking adds to the 85mmish misery on the Canon mounts for me. A bulky 50mm is o.k., as 50 is versatile enough, but a bulky 85mm is not o.k. It's also not needed as the focal length is long enough not to need f/1.2. The Samyang RF 85mm f/1.4 and Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art for Sony are showing what's technical possible to reduce size and weight. If we're really only getting the choice between a 3000 euro 1200 grams RF f/1.2 85mm or, at the same price point, a Sigma 85mm f/1.4 DG DN Art + Sony full frame camera for free it's not a difficult decision for me. I would rather pick that as my second system and sell off all the M and other crop stuff. The Samyang 45 f/1.8 will replace the 32mm f/1.4. I'll like that 70mm f/1.8 as well. All the EF sigma's will work via MC-11. And if that Tamron 35-150mm f/2.0-2.8 is any good Sony FE is a better platform for me than M. Heck, those crippling and other gap creating games of Canon are even making me holding back for an RF 50mm f/1.2. That new G-master won't be a bad lens either.
-- hide signature --I love 50mm (equivalence)
thunder storm's gear list:thunder storm's gear list Canon EOS 6D Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R5 Sony a7 IV Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM +24 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to Alexis • Sep 13, 2021Alexis wrote:
MAC wrote:
RLight wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
gosh, I knew you'd miss it, but how can you resist it????
m6II + M32 + DXO Pl4 Elite with Deep Prime + DXO Film Pack + 430RT + EL-1 on stand with magmods -- slam dunk more practical, way less expensive, you need OCF light, lighter, and more fun than the R3 brick
IF ONLY it had a built-in EVF I'd buy one in a millisecond. For now M50 all the way!
agree with those longer lenses of yours
I'm only using so far with shorter lenses like the 32 and so far the back screen has been ok. I didn't want to wait forever for M5II. I almost bought M50II instead of M6II, but for my more narrow application as an adjunct camera, the 33 MPXL sensor combined with DXO PL4 Elite is really exceeding my expectations for image quality with nice dynamic range and usability up to iso 6400. I can go large with scapes from my toki 10-17 and my m32 out of this sensor
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to R2D2 • Sep 13, 2021R2D2 wrote:
thunder storm wrote:
R2D2 wrote:
Agree with all of Alastair’s points.
I can only speak to the M6ii (and not the M50ii), but the M6ii’s AF is simply outstanding using the Spot AF frame (I use Spot for darn near everything). It’ll kick the 80D’s butt (I used to own the 7D2 and it kicked the 7D2’s butt!). Here’s a previous thread with some good info…
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4501836#forum-post-64108171
Bottom line, the M6ii is a wonderful upgrade to the M6 in every way. Highly recommended.
R2
Subject/face/eye tracking is lacking in my opinion. It seems to me those tracking modes are slowing down the AF making it less accurate at least with some lenses. The Sigma 18-35mm f/1.8 seams to do well, but the 56mm + tracking modes is not up to the task for my use cases. As soon there's motion the hitrate will suffer as soon as you let the camera do the tracking.
Doing candid environmental stuff the camera also tends to pic the background over the subject using face tracking. This is also the case with the 32mm with it's f/1.4 aperture. All Canon mirrorless cameras have this to some extend, but the M6mkII does worse here compared to my R.
Agree. The only case that I’ve ever recommended using Face/Eye tracking with the M6ii is when the subject is close (like fill the frame close!).
If a person has followed my recommendations and instead uses Spot AFfor EVERYTHING, then they’re golden. I’ve spent almost threee years now demonstrating exactly this. Otherwise they shoot at their peril!
R2
for an $850 body that is light and fun, sounds right to me
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain RLight • Veteran Member • Posts: 5,623 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to MAC • Sep 13, 2021 1MAC wrote:
Alexis wrote:
MAC wrote:
RLight wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
gosh, I knew you'd miss it, but how can you resist it????
m6II + M32 + DXO Pl4 Elite with Deep Prime + DXO Film Pack + 430RT + EL-1 on stand with magmods -- slam dunk more practical, way less expensive, you need OCF light, lighter, and more fun than the R3 brick
IF ONLY it had a built-in EVF I'd buy one in a millisecond. For now M50 all the way!
agree with those longer lenses of yours
I'm only using so far with shorter lenses like the 32 and so far the back screen has been ok. I didn't want to wait forever for M5II. I almost bought M50II instead of M6II, but for my more narrow application as an adjunct camera, the 33 MPXL sensor combined with DXO PL4 Elite is really exceeding my expectations for image quality with nice dynamic range and usability up to iso 6400. I can go large with scapes from my toki 10-17 and my m32 out of this sensor
I don’t know an M5 II will ever happen, sadly. Given the COVID market + RF sucking all the air out of the room and ILCs were on the decline before this? I’m going to bet no M5 II. I can dream though.
If Canon did a more aggressive normal zoom for the M, I’d be back. Again, RF is competing. Canons worst enemy is Canon. What else is new I suppose.
RLight's gear list:RLight's gear list Canon G5 X II Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R3 Canon EOS R5 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM +12 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain MAC • Forum Pro • Posts: 19,411 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to RLight • Sep 13, 2021 2RLight wrote:
MAC wrote:
Alexis wrote:
MAC wrote:
RLight wrote:
Fandor wrote:
Thanks for the links to previous discussions and sharing your experiences. M6 mk2 has the lead right now;-)
As a former M50 (Mark I) and M6 II owner and existing R owner let me say the M6 II doesn't really leave much to be desired in terms of AF. It's better than my R, particularly when it comes to telephoto where my R is a slouch, the M6 II is not.
The M6 II sensor is about 2/3 stops better in ISO performance vs the M50 sensor. That and the 14FPS, 4K, are just a slam dunk for the M6 Mark II. It's an easy decision. Battery life is WAY better on the M6 II btw. Say nothing of 32MP vs 24MP in terms of detail rendition.
M50 Mark II wins in price, naturally. And hotshoe + EVF included, if needed. Otherwise if you're trying to compare? It's not even a fair fight comparing the two. I've never shot the M50 Mark II, but I don't need to. I'm sure it's AF is amazing, but, the M6 II never left me wanting, after the firmware upgrade anyways. That was actually quite important. That 90D sensor is what, 3-4 years newer, it really shows.
BTW, I used to own an M6 Mark I, the Mark II just leaves it in the dust in terms of Autofocus. In fact, it leaves your 80D in the dust. I'm serious. I like the 80D Autofocus (it's very good), but it's like having an 80D with full frame coverage, touch and drag, low-light AF, and eye-AF. Plus no AFMA and then a bit better. The M6 II's AF is in fact limited to what lens is mounted. Mounting a 70-300 IS USM (Nano-USM motor) is REALLY impressive. Folks use the M6 II over the 90D for birding because its AF is apparently better. That's saying a lot. I'm not pulling your leg. The only thing that might be better? 7D Mark II. But even there, I might still question if the M6 II is better as it's more low-light capable, and does eye-AF.
DPR tested them side by side and said the same thing. Don't take my word for it.
https://www.dpreview.com/articles/9482211769/which-would-you-choose-shooting-the-canon-eos-90d-and-eos-m6-mark-ii-in-atlanta
They outright say the 90D leaves the 80D AF in the dust. And, the M6 II / 90D DPAF, leave that in the dust. Their primary complaints? OVF vs EVF, buffer sizes. Autofocus was never a compliant. Go figure.
gosh, I knew you'd miss it, but how can you resist it????
m6II + M32 + DXO Pl4 Elite with Deep Prime + DXO Film Pack + 430RT + EL-1 on stand with magmods -- slam dunk more practical, way less expensive, you need OCF light, lighter, and more fun than the R3 brick
IF ONLY it had a built-in EVF I'd buy one in a millisecond. For now M50 all the way!
agree with those longer lenses of yours
I'm only using so far with shorter lenses like the 32 and so far the back screen has been ok. I didn't want to wait forever for M5II. I almost bought M50II instead of M6II, but for my more narrow application as an adjunct camera, the 33 MPXL sensor combined with DXO PL4 Elite is really exceeding my expectations for image quality with nice dynamic range and usability up to iso 6400. I can go large with scapes from my toki 10-17 and my m32 out of this sensor
I don’t know an M5 II will ever happen, sadly. Given the COVID market + RF sucking all the air out of the room and ILCs were on the decline before this? I’m going to bet no M5 II. I can dream though.
If Canon did a more aggressive normal zoom for the M, I’d be back. Again, RF is competing. Canons worst enemy is Canon. What else is new I suppose.
Sales, Sales, Sales
if Sony releases a new 6600 v2 with a great GUI, an better 33 mpxl sensor, a 22 pancake that is as good as the X100V, and the new camera working with dxo PL4 Elite, then it will have me thinking to sell my canon stuff and get Sony stuff. I’m tired of them crippling stuff. I’m tired of them not giving small stuff enough priority
MAC's gear list:MAC's gear list Canon EOS 7D Mark II Canon EOS RP Canon EOS M6 II Canon EOS R8 Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM +7 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain OP Fandor • New Member • Posts: 11 Re: Focus speed and accuracy of M50 mark II vs. M6 mark II? In reply to RLight • Sep 14, 2021RLight - Thank you for the very thorough reply, and the reminder of the other beneficial features. You almost had me ordering a M6 II on the spot :-), but I've told myself to wait until Nov/Dec for a chance it goes on sale.
Fandor's gear list:Fandor's gear list Canon EOS 80D Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Sigma 35mm F1.4 DG HSM Art +8 more Reply Reply with quote Reply to thread Complain
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