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• Thread starter Thread starter mkoverwatch
• Start date Start date Dec 31, 2019

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mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA I currently have an HD598 with a Fulla 2. I am looking to upgrade to something else. My problem with the 598 is that the vocals just don't feel clear enough/don't stand out enough. It seems muffled/muddy. I usually listen to songs with male vocals. I ordered a DT880 premium 250 just to compare also. The 6xx seems to be cheaper than any 600 that I can find. I have tried the 770s but I know they are closed. They didn't compare to the 598s. The emotion in the vocals stood out more on the 598s. Any recommendations? Last edited: Dec 31, 2019

gimmeheadroom

Headphoneus Supremus

Joined Feb 8, 2018 Posts 10,454 Likes 12,038 Location Czech Republic On paper the Fulla absolutely does not have enough power for the 600s. I suspect it will be equally miserable trying to driver the Beyers you mentioned. I don't know anything about the 598. The 6XX is based on the 650, not the 600, but it has identical power demands. The choice between the 600 and 650/6XX is more about the kind of sound you like. I think if you want better sound you might want to consider a serious amp and a good pair of headphones. Last edited: Dec 31, 2019 Beer! It's what's for dinner... Sennheiser guy since 1980. The plural of vinyl is vinyl. I don't listen to my gear, I listen to music with my gear. That doesn't mean I don't hear my gear because sometimes I do. If you make espresso, you're gonna get burned. Cables don't kill treble, EQ kills treble -- @gimmeheadroom. "Using some measurements to define audio equipment performance, is similar to using a tape measure to define how good looking someone is." -- @Jandu Spoiler: Some of my audio gear... Headstation: Lenovo M75t; Audio-gd DI-20, coax; Mytek Brooklyn DAC+; RME ADI-2 DAC FS (AKM, 2nd Ed., first batch in Europe); Violectric V280; SPL Phonitor 2; Bluesound Node 2i; Wireworld Chroma 8 coax. Airplane rig: Hiby RS2; Shure SE535 2 Channel: Lenovo M90n IoT, Audio-gd DI-20HE, Master 19, R8 MK2; Mutec REF10, MC-3+ USB, MC-1.1+; TASCAM DA-3000, RW901MKII; Oppo UDP-205; Bluesound B100S; Musical Fidelity M5si, Klipsch R-26F floorstanders on custom isolators; DIY AES/EBU and balanced analog cables from Sommer cable stock, Hicon connectors; Wireworld Ultraviolet 7 HDMI & coax; Damar & Hagen; bydpete; Tertiary systems: Yamaha MusicCast; JBL Control 5s on Gravity stands; Audio-gd R2R-11 rev. 0; KRK Classic 5s on foam pads; ATROX V2 Music: FreeBSD ZFS running on Xeon, CIFS/Samba and minidlna | Tidal MQA | Deezer Hifi | ScAmazon HD | Foobar2000 | ASIOProxy | BluOS | Yamaha MusicCast My humble cannery: Sennheiser PX 100, HD 25 plastic, Aluminum, and 75th Anniv., HD 600, HD 800, Fostex TH900mk2 SB, TR-X00 Mahogany, Audeze LCD-2C, 3F, HIFIMAN HE6SE V2, HE400i 2020, Beyer DT 1770, DT 880/600, Shure SE535, SE215, RHA MA-750, Dunu Trident, Cables by customcans.co.uk and skyaudiocables. Steel Hifiman grilles in pretty colors

tomb

Member of the Trade: Beezar.com

Joined Mar 1, 2006 Posts 10,891 Likes 1,074 I agree with gimmeheadroom's post. However, going on your title for the thread, I think the HD6XX is one of the truly best deals in all of audio. The 650 is better than the 600. In one of the greatest contradictory statements he ever wrote, Tyll stated that the HD650 is definitely "more refined" than the 600, but then went on to say he preferred the sound of the HD600. Sorry. The 600 will break up a bit on high-peak, high-midrange notes. Some call it "grainy" at those frequencies. You will not hear this on the HD650/6XX. I have owned the HD580, HD600 for many years and the HD6XX for 2-3 years. The HD6XX (tests the same as the 650) is simply better than both. You didn't mention the HD580, but it was the original in the 580/600/650 family. It's a great headphone, too, but it has more grain than the 600. They kept improving the design with each model. History and testing confirms that.

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mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA

tomb said: I agree with gimmeheadroom's post. However, going on your title for the thread, I think the HD6XX is one of the truly best deals in all of audio. The 650 is better than the 600. In one of the greatest contradictory statements he ever wrote, Tyll stated that the HD650 is definitely "more refined" than the 600, but then went on to say he preferred the sound of the HD600. Sorry. The 600 will break up a bit on high-peak, high-midrange notes. Some call it "grainy" at those frequencies. You will not hear this on the HD650/6XX. I have owned the HD580, HD600 for many years and the HD6XX for 2-3 years. The HD6XX (tests the same as the 650) is simply better than both. You didn't mention the HD580, but it was the original in the 580/600/650 family. It's a great headphone, too, but it has more grain than the 600. They kept improving the design with each model. History and testing confirms that. Click to expand...

Thanks... just ordered the 6xx to try out. M

mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA

gimmeheadroom said: On paper the Fulla absolutely does not have enough power for the 600s. I suspect it will be equally miserable trying to driver the Beyers you mentioned. I don't know anything about the 598. The 6XX is based on the 650, not the 600, but it has identical power demands. The choice between the 600 and 650/6XX is more about the kind of sound you like. I think if you want better sound you might want to consider a serious amp and a good pair of headphones. Click to expand...

Does the fulla 2 seriously not have enough power? I just bought it and can still return it. I don't just have tons of cash to spend though. I'm only going to be using this on my PC. 100 bucks for the fulla is already more than I wanted to spend on an amp.

ProtegeManiac

Headphoneus Supremus

Joined Oct 29, 2009 Posts 16,949 Likes 3,405 Location SoCal

borderal said: Does the fulla 2 seriously not have enough power? I just bought it and can still return it. I don't just have tons of cash to spend though. I'm only going to be using this on my PC. 100 bucks for the fulla is already more than I wanted to spend on an amp. Click to expand...

If you never really crank it up, there's only a little improvement. If you do crank it up, there's a huge difference between 40mW out of the Fulla and getting 256mW of Class A power out of the Asgard3 (and it goes up to 600mW, although it switches over to Class B by that point).

gimmeheadroom

Headphoneus Supremus

Joined Feb 8, 2018 Posts 10,454 Likes 12,038 Location Czech Republic The thing about the 600 series (well I don't know about the 660 but it is true of 600, 650/6XX) is that they really scale well. You can almost not buy an amp that is too good for them. The better quality power you feed them the better they sound. You have to spend a lot of money to get something "better" and many people are happy with one of these forever. The 600 series get along very well with OTL (form of tube) amps. To me it's how they were meant to sound. Beer! It's what's for dinner... Sennheiser guy since 1980. The plural of vinyl is vinyl. I don't listen to my gear, I listen to music with my gear. That doesn't mean I don't hear my gear because sometimes I do. If you make espresso, you're gonna get burned. Cables don't kill treble, EQ kills treble -- @gimmeheadroom. "Using some measurements to define audio equipment performance, is similar to using a tape measure to define how good looking someone is." -- @Jandu Spoiler: Some of my audio gear... Headstation: Lenovo M75t; Audio-gd DI-20, coax; Mytek Brooklyn DAC+; RME ADI-2 DAC FS (AKM, 2nd Ed., first batch in Europe); Violectric V280; SPL Phonitor 2; Bluesound Node 2i; Wireworld Chroma 8 coax. Airplane rig: Hiby RS2; Shure SE535 2 Channel: Lenovo M90n IoT, Audio-gd DI-20HE, Master 19, R8 MK2; Mutec REF10, MC-3+ USB, MC-1.1+; TASCAM DA-3000, RW901MKII; Oppo UDP-205; Bluesound B100S; Musical Fidelity M5si, Klipsch R-26F floorstanders on custom isolators; DIY AES/EBU and balanced analog cables from Sommer cable stock, Hicon connectors; Wireworld Ultraviolet 7 HDMI & coax; Damar & Hagen; bydpete; Tertiary systems: Yamaha MusicCast; JBL Control 5s on Gravity stands; Audio-gd R2R-11 rev. 0; KRK Classic 5s on foam pads; ATROX V2 Music: FreeBSD ZFS running on Xeon, CIFS/Samba and minidlna | Tidal MQA | Deezer Hifi | ScAmazon HD | Foobar2000 | ASIOProxy | BluOS | Yamaha MusicCast My humble cannery: Sennheiser PX 100, HD 25 plastic, Aluminum, and 75th Anniv., HD 600, HD 800, Fostex TH900mk2 SB, TR-X00 Mahogany, Audeze LCD-2C, 3F, HIFIMAN HE6SE V2, HE400i 2020, Beyer DT 1770, DT 880/600, Shure SE535, SE215, RHA MA-750, Dunu Trident, Cables by customcans.co.uk and skyaudiocables. Steel Hifiman grilles in pretty colors

Alexnova

500+ Head-Fier

Joined Dec 3, 2012 Posts 562 Likes 739

tomb said: I agree with gimmeheadroom's post. However, going on your title for the thread, I think the HD6XX is one of the truly best deals in all of audio. The 650 is better than the 600. In one of the greatest contradictory statements he ever wrote, Tyll stated that the HD650 is definitely "more refined" than the 600, but then went on to say he preferred the sound of the HD600. Sorry. The 600 will break up a bit on high-peak, high-midrange notes. Some call it "grainy" at those frequencies. You will not hear this on the HD650/6XX. I have owned the HD580, HD600 for many years and the HD6XX for 2-3 years. The HD6XX (tests the same as the 650) is simply better than both. You didn't mention the HD580, but it was the original in the 580/600/650 family. It's a great headphone, too, but it has more grain than the 600. They kept improving the design with each model. History and testing confirms that. Click to expand...

Completely agree. The driver on the HD650 sounds more controlled and refined than the HD600. Vocals are also a bit more shouty due to that 2-3khz bump on the HD600. There's also some grain present in the highs. Honestly the HD650 sounds fantastic in a OTL or other tube amp setup. Solid state amps don't work in my experience. I think the reason Tyll preferred the sound of the HD600 is because he listened to headphones way to much back then. Folks who wear headphones all the time usually prefer a slight treble elevation. I'm a speaker guy now and I can't handle any headphone that has any kind of elevated treble or spikes. The HD650 is the only can I can listen to for hours without fatigue and not worried about treble spikes. Last edited: Jan 1, 2020

Alexnova

500+ Head-Fier

Joined Dec 3, 2012 Posts 562 Likes 739

gimmeheadroom said: The thing about the 600 series (well I don't know about the 660 but it is true of 600, 650/6XX) is that they really scale well. You can almost not buy an amp that is too good for them. The better quality power you feed them the better they sound. You have to spend a lot of money to get something "better" and many people are happy with one of these forever. The 600 series get along very well with OTL (form of tube) amps. To me it's how they were meant to sound. Click to expand...

Yep the only thing that holds back the 600 series of phones are DACs and tube amps. M

mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA

Alexnova said: Yep the only thing that holds back the 600 series of phones are DACs and tube amps. Click to expand...

So is there anything I can get of similar value to my fulla2 (100$). Or should I just stick with that. I'm not a professional by any means. Is it really not going to be loud at all?

Alexnova

500+ Head-Fier

Joined Dec 3, 2012 Posts 562 Likes 739 Get a Vali 2 M

mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA

Alexnova said: Get a Vali 2 Click to expand...

Don't I need a DAC too though... I'm not spending more than 150 total for headphone accessories

Alexnova

500+ Head-Fier

Joined Dec 3, 2012 Posts 562 Likes 739 The Vali 2 is the cheapest I can recommend for the HD650. You don't need a DAC yet. The HD6X0 series demands proper amplification. You can't plug it into just anything and get great results. M

mkoverwatch

Previously known as borderal

Joined Dec 29, 2019 Posts 26 Likes 2 Location USA

Alexnova said: The Vali 2 is the cheapest I can recommend for the HD650. You don't need a DAC yet. The HD6X0 series demands proper amplification. You can't plug it into just anything and get great results. Click to expand...

A DAC isn't necessary? My motherboard is kinda old.

ProtegeManiac

Headphoneus Supremus

Joined Oct 29, 2009 Posts 16,949 Likes 3,405 Location SoCal

borderal said: Don't I need a DAC too though... I'm not spending more than 150 total for headphone accessories Click to expand...

Use the Fulla2 now, buy an amp later and use the Fulla2 as a DAC. Just look at the manual to make sure you hook it up properly.

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