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Which bank has the safest "statement" gold?

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29-06-2009, 03:29 PM #1 jabalong
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Which bank has the safest "statement" gold?

HSBC and its related bank Hang Seng Bank both have a gold service where you can buy and trade in units of MACE online. This is "paper" gold in that it's based on contracts the bank has and you never actually deal in any physical gold. As such, in a worse case scenario, you could end up holding worthless paper contracts. Though as long as you believe that HSBC is stable, which it ought to be, that's probably okay. However, I notice that Wing Hang Bank has a "passbook" type of gold where you buy and sell it online, but you can also withdraw it at any time. It comes in three forms: 99 Fine Gold Passbook, Gold Maple Leaf Passbook, Ounce Gold Passbook (9999 Gold). This sounds pretty good, though I'm not sure I'm as confident in Wing Hang as I am in HSBC. Does this Wing Hang passbook gold really amount to "allocated" physical gold, whereby in a worse case scenario of the bank folding that this gold belongs to you and isn't just some paper contract with the bank? Along a similar line, I see that Bank of China seems to have passbook gold too: Hong Kong 99 Gold(Passbook), Hong Kong 9999 Gold(Passbook). This sounds like the Wing Hang service, though can't be sure as the website doesn't give details. Does this also allow you to withdraw your holdings in that type of physical gold? I'd be interested to hear from anyone with experience with any of the above services and/or advise if there are other banks to consider too. For instance, Standard Chartered would have some appeal to me, but as far as I know they don't have any statement/passbook gold service. I'm most interested in getting idea of which would be the safest service - ie, with which one are you closest to holding physical gold that's actually in the bank's coffers and belongs to you. Not saying the end of the world is upon us, but if you're going to buy gold, it seems to me make sense to have the safest option. Of course one could just go buy and hold physical gold, but then there's security and storage concerns I'd rather not deal with if there's a better option out there with a high degree of safety.
30-06-2009, 02:23 PM #2 jabalong
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As a follow-up, I went to Bank of China and confirmed that their online gold trading account is only online and to be withdrawn as cash not physical gold. They do however sell gold coins, such as the Canadian Maple, but their physical gold coin sales are separate from their online gold accounts.
30-06-2009, 03:02 PM #3 mercury_element
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thanks for the info jabalong. really helpful
01-07-2009, 10:18 PM #4 Raccon
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Originally Posted by jabalong: Not saying the end of the world is upon us, but if you're going to buy gold, it seems to me make sense to have the safest option. Of course one could just go buy and hold physical gold, but then there's security and storage concerns I'd rather not deal with if there's a better option out there with a high degree of safety. I would say physical gold in the bank's safe (which you can rent) is safer than paper gold. Else consider some gold ETF, some secure it via physical gold but withdrawing it usually carries hefty fees and in case of a worst case scenario you may not be able to get to the gold anyway, in particular if it's stored in another country. But if it comes to that unsecured paper gold will be worthless as well, regardless of how stable the issuer / the bank is now.
02-07-2009, 05:57 PM #5 discobay
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Are the rumours true that the price of gold is set to drop this year? Posted via Mobile Device
02-07-2009, 11:52 PM #6 jabalong
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There's no doubt that in the spectrum of gold ownership from having the physical stuff in your hands to allocated gold to unallocated gold that the paper gold from these banks isn't the safest. That said though for trading in and out it's quite convenient, assuming you're okay with the risk of this paper trading and the health of your bank. That's why this idea from Wing Hang Bank that you can go one step further and withdraw the gold you're trading online as actual physical gold piqued my interest. Was wondering if that means the gold is allocated in your name when you buy it and if the bank goes belly up that it would still belong to you. Went to the Wing Hang central branch today to try get answers but it was hard to get much clarity from them through the language barrier and the fact that I just don't think they knew the answer. They gave me a pamphlet but the description of the terms and conditions is pretty flimsy. Would still like to get a definitive answer. As an aside, BullionVault is a service that's grown rapidly in recent years and received quite a lot of accolades. It's an online marketplace for buying and selling gold, where your holdings are allocated to you in the vault of your choosing. So that in the even that the service goes belly up, you would be entitled to claim your gold that would be in your name with the third-party custodian of the vault.
06-07-2009, 12:12 PM #7 bychineva
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Originally Posted by discobay: Are the rumours true that the price of gold is set to drop this year? Posted via Mobile Device Must buy gold on dips, I have talked with top analysts in HK and talked with the CEO of the worlds second largest gold company and both believe the gold will appreciate to 1345 usd/per oz. So we must buy gold on dips, the current gold price is 930. I would start buying at 923, 913,905,890 and finally 875.
06-07-2009, 12:17 PM #8 discobay
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OK thanks. I already have some. Just checking its future.
06-07-2009, 12:54 PM #9 Raccon
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Originally Posted by bychineva: Must buy gold on dips, I have talked with top analysts in HK and talked with the CEO of the worlds second largest gold company and both believe the gold will appreciate to 1345 usd/per oz. So we must buy gold on dips, the current gold price is 930. I would start buying at 923, 913,905,890 and finally 875. What else would the CEO of the world 2nd largest gold company (which is?) say except that the price will rise? And how the heck did he get that exact figure - crystalball?
06-07-2009, 10:57 PM #10 bychineva
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Originally Posted by Raccon: What else would the CEO of the world 2nd largest gold company (which is?) say except that the price will rise? And how the heck did he get that exact figure - crystalball? Was Rio Tinto (but now merged with BHP)...usually the price of ETF's(gold/silver) will move first and 2-3 months the gold/silver shall follow. The price 1300 is based on technicals,forecasting future economic data, forecasting the supply and demand for gold.

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Tags for this Thread

gold maple leaf, worse case scenario, hang seng bank, paper contracts, wing hang bank, physical gold, paper contract, passbook, paper gold, gold service, bank of china, standard chartered, hsbc, coffers, mace, ounce, hong kong, banks, storage